Might I suggest adding the 'getting myself 1starred as an object lesson' tag, then?

it could have been fine, the concept is there, but the ending just kind of ruins it, which i didn't even see until after i submitted

tests classic poE but u wouldn't knoE

Actually, I think this is the best use of that song I've ever heard.

Right up there with Huey Lewis and the news.

I don't think sex with your cats counts, John.

I'm sorry, that just slipped out. Please go on.

Rodgers was never going to amount to anything even if he had lost his virginity. The guy was a straight up psycho.

I see now. If elliot rodger had fucked a disabled man's shitty asshole he would have seen the light of Jesus Christ and become a contributing citizen.

Orcs raises a good point. Mr Holmes, your argument is essentially the same as TFL Bill's, although granted you're coming at it from a different direction. You're reaching all around the issue, trying to assign blame to some edifice of vaguely-defined social constructs which appear threatening to you, and ultimately coming to the conclusion that all of this could have been solved With Sex. At no point do you seem to be aware that Elliot Rodger was simply a psycho; an aberration by definition, and not reflective of any broader trends.

As Nikon says, Rodger losing his virginity wouldn't have made any difference. And as Orcs says, there may be a certain self-projecting element to your argument. Regardless, it is absurd to claim that virgin-shaming precipitated Rodger's rampage, and doubly absurd to claim that if only he'd had sex with someone, this story would have had a happy ending (evidently because, in your opinion, sex isn't fun).

What the fuck?

>>Orcs raises a good point. Mr Holmes, your arguSo if you take into account the words I used, and what the words mean, ment is essentially the same as TFL Bill's, although granted you're coming at it from a different direction. You're reaching all around the issue, trying to assign blame to some edifice of vaguely-defined social constructs which appear threatening to you, and ultimately coming to the conclusion that all of this could have been solved With Sex.

That not even remotely my argument. What I said was:

>>if Eliot Rodgers had sex, he might realize that, while sex is really nice, it's not worth killing yourself over.

What I'm saying is that sex isn't worth killing yourself, and Rodgers was a clueless noob for killing himself and others over sex. It's hardly a controversial statement.

>>Rodgers was never going to amount to anything even if he had lost his virginity. The guy was a straight up psycho.

This is obviously true, though I suppose there's a chance he wouldn’t have acted out like that, quite so soon. i think the truest truth is that, outside of prostitution, Eliot Rodger was just about 100 per cent unlayable, and it never would have happened.

>>I see now. If elliot rodger had fucked a disabled man's shitty asshole he would have seen the light of Jesus Christ and become a contributing citizen.

Orcs, I sincerely wish I could do something for you. It's easy to imagine that a person who behaves in such a consistently vile manner isn't happy, but that's more than I can know. I don't know anything about you, including your gender. All I know is that whatever the deal is with you, it's beyond my understanding. and beyond my control. If you choose to hate me, that's your choice, and while I doubt that hating me will bring you any happiness, you have my blessing to try. But there's nothing for me in this relationship, and in the future, I intend to not participate. You don't seem like a nice person, but you've never done me any harm, and I wish you all the best.

>> What I'm saying is that sex isn't worth killing yourself, and Rodgers was a clueless noob for killing himself and others over sex.

I KNOW you said that sex isn't worth killing yourself over; that's not the issue. You also said - and here you are implying it again - that if Elliot Rodger got laid, it would have solved his problems. THAT is the issue.

Now you think what you said was fine, because, one, you said it, and two, in your opinion, sex is pretty lame (therefore not worth dying over), whereas in TFL Bill's opinion, sex is great (worth killing for, unless you're already getting it). You feel that your rationale diverges far enough from the usual TFL reasoning that you are no longer in the same boat as the late Mr Rodger et al. But we are telling you, this is not the case!! *The idea that having sex would have magically cured him is absurd, full stop.* It does not matter whether he would have been cured because he found sex to be awesome, or because he found sex to be as sad and unfulfilling as you evidently have.

He was a psycho. He would not have been cured. This is what Nikon was trying to tell you, and it ties in with one of the statements I made before, namely: "You're reaching all around the issue, trying to assign blame to some edifice of vaguely-defined social constructs which appear threatening to you". Elliot Rodger did not murder a bunch of people because society was virgin-shaming him. He did not murder people because gender-roles/ feminism/ MRA/ Nice Guy Syndrome/ whatever else. He murdered people because he was batshit insane - one of these rare, isolated individuals, who are not representative of any given segment of society, and whose actions we cannot assume to be indicative of broader trends.

you can do something for me, get up a rocking motion until you gain enough perpetual motion to begin rolling, then roll/lurch your way up those filthy basement stairs, carefully roll into the shared kitchen of your filthy section 8 hovel, then roll yourself towards the oven, flap a fleshy appendage at the door until it pops open, then lurch/crawl your way as far into the oven as you can (it will likely only house a partial amount of your immense distended cranium but that's fine for our intended purpose) ONLY after setting the temperature dial to 500 degrees (don't worry you don't need to light the pilot light) then just kind of hang out there for a bit and see what happens. remember to mind the immense grease trail you have left so that your fellow emergency housing roomates don't slip and bust their asses or become infected by the various airborne bacteria that swirl around your shuddering diseased manitee body

(Golf clap)

Homer, is this what you're referring to?

>>:I'd love to see a satirical teenage sex comedy based on the Rodgers case.
In the last reel, instead of going on the killing spree he's been planning, he gets laid, and it solves all his problems. Of course, no one would get the joke. The trailer probably works a whole lot better.

>>you can do something for me, get up a rocking motion until you gain enough perpetual motion to begin rolling, then roll/lurch your way up those filthy basement stairs, carefully roll into the shared kitchen of your filthy section 8 hovel, then roll yourself towards the oven, flap a fleshy appendage at the door until it pops open, then lurch/crawl your way as far into the oven as you can (it will likely only house a partial amount of your immense distended cranium but that's fine for our intended purpose) ONLY after setting the temperature dial to 500 degrees (don't worry you don't need to light the pilot light) then just kind of hang out there for a bit and see what happens. remember to mind the immense grease trail you have left so that your fellow emergency housing roomates don't slip and bust their asses or become infected by the various airborne bacteria that swirl around your shuddering diseased manitee body

Did that make you feel better? I truly hope that it did.

No, I am referring to the entirety of what you wrote, with an emphasis on your "Grandpa Simpson" moment at the start of Paragraph 3:

"Bel;ieve it or not, I've had sex... and in my opinion, if Eliot Rodgers had sex, he might realize that, while sex is really nice, it's not worth killing yourself over" {JH 1}

and your statements at the start of Paragraph 2:

"... Eliot Rodgers was definitely influenced by the same myths about male sexuality ... It's the MYTHS about gender that are toxic, not the state of being male." {JH 2}

I am trying to tell you that his having-had or not-having-had sex is irrelevant, and furthermore, that you are mistaken for trying to tie this in to some deeper narrative about social constructs, when in fact there is no evidence that this had any direct correlation to Rodger's being a nutjob.

I suppose next you're going to try and tell me that the passage you just now quoted ("I'd love to see ... teenage sex") was meant to be taken ironically, despite the fact that, if it WERE stated ironically, it would contradict the "solution" implied by {JH 1}.

In case you do not get the reference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1rscPaS7TQ

It makes me feel better that you had to read that twice

If it makes you feel better to believe that I actually read your post, instead of just copying and pasting after I got the general idea, I don't see any harm in that.

I see harm in your general existence john and I, nay we, shall not rest until it has been wiped out

As long as you got the general idea, which is you are a human inner tube made flesh

Actually, chronologically, its more like "flesh become inner tube". The flesh came first.

I hate to say it John Holmes, but I'm starting to agree with your naysayers here.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/emilywillingham/2014/05/30/elliot- rodger-didnt-have-autism-he-had-anger/

The only thing I'm willing to support you on is the fact that no one has directly gone against the "might" tense. But if his family had enough money for their family attorney to out right claim Elliot had something that multiple clinicians did NOT detect.

Maybe he was one of the very few functioning autistics to be confident and outgoing enough to try to blend in society, but having sex would not have taken away a very needy, bratty and entitled behavior, which to me is a pathological problem. Being that obsessed with some term and condition with out any fore sight or second thought is more relevant to running from something than being tied to a myth.

*properly gone against the "might" tense

>>Maybe he was one of the very few functioning autistics to be confident and outgoing enough to try to blend in society, but having sex would not have taken away a very needy, bratty and entitled behavior, which to me is a pathological problem.

I agree. Look, it's obviously my fault that what I wrote was confusing. But I tried to clarify that about thirty hours ago. That's why I said that we're arguing about what we're arguing about.

>>Being that obsessed with some term and condition with out any fore sight or second thought is more relevant to running from something than being tied to a myth.

My original statement was that Eliot Rodger's story reimagined as a teen sex comedy is a great satire of contemporary male culture. That's not the same thing as a psychological treatise about the origin of Rodger's madness.

I think Rodger embodies the myth. The myth didn’t create Rodger.

So then how do you explain sentence {JH 1}:

"in my opinion, if Eliot Rodgers had sex, he might realize that, while sex is really nice, it's not worth killing yourself over."

You keep switching between saying one thing, and saying another. Either having sex would be a positive influence on Elliot's life-choices, or having sex would not. These positions are contradictory; you cannot endorse both statements at the same time.

No, I am totally familiar with the word "myth". Perhaps you are unfamiliar with the phrase "social construct"?

Actually, yes I am . Though I know what "social" means, and what "construct" means. It just sounds like something a whole lot more concrete anmd finite and understandable than anything I was implying.

No, see, you believe it's irrelevant because you believe that sex itself is unfulfilling. The sex you've had was, evidently, rather disappointing for both parties involved. That's OK, but it still leaves us with the fact your arguments so far have been based upon sex; you and this hypothetical "MRA community" you claim exists are coming at the Rodgers question from different directions, of course - yours is sex-negative, theirs is sex-positive - but ultimately, you both believe that the problem here comes down to sexing. Either them wanting sex and not getting it, or them wanting sex, not getting it, and being dumb because IYHO sex isn't worth the bother.

Yes, I know you are talking about alleged myths about sex. I never said you weren't. In fact, I have said, at least three times now, that I know this is what you are saying.

What we are saying is that all this stuff you're talking about is irrelevant. You're missing the point, John: Elliot Rodger wasn't a nutjob because he hadn't yet read your blogs and acquired an enlightened understanding of sex and the true meaning of happiness. He was a nutjob because he was balls-out psycho, plain and simple. You can't blame cultural constructs (or "myths", in this case) for what Mr Rodger did; there may certainly be *problems* with myths about sex, sure, I won't dispute that (at least not in this video). Maybe in a different context, what you're talking aboout would matter. But here, in regards to Elliot Rodger specifically, no. You are falling into exactly the same trap as TFL Bill: trying to assign blame to "myths", instead of accepting that the blame is Rodger's.

Homer, what I originally said was that translating Elliot Rodger's story into a "Risky Business" "girl next door" teenage sex comedy could be great satire of current male culture, and i tried to explain why.

Internet misogyny didn't make Eliot Rodger a psychopath. It may have influenced the kjind of psychopath he turned out to be, but in the end, I don't know where the relationship is. It's not simple cause and effect. Therefore, nothing I say should be is or should be interpreted as a interpreted . That's why I'm talking about a satire, and not a treatise on psychology.

But I do think there's a relationship. He didn't exist in a vacuum. He was one of those guys posting angry shit about women, and after he died, there were guys on the internet calling him a hero. His story has something to say about the current climate, and if you don't think so, you're in total fucking denial.

Of course it has something to say. What it says is, "John Holmes Motherfucker is in the boat as TFL Bill". As I said previously, and I quote "there may certainly be *problems* with myths about sex" - and one of these problems, evidently, is that they create people like you and your TFL friends, always looking for some shadowy conspiracy, when sometimes (particularly when statistics show no real danger or correlation between the alleged construct and the consequent Bad Behavior predicted by your theory) the answer is as simple as can be.

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r135/sandystarbucks/cartoon s/FarSide1.jpg~original

Methinks the troll doth become testy.

So you're a 19 girl who grew up in Texas, who lost a close friend to violence, and have taken her name as a kind of memorial?

Jesus, that's horrible. I really wish you'd let me be nice to you, but whatever you need, except for the thing with the oven. I am truly sorry for your loss.

I'm really impressed and encouraged that a 19 year old woman in 2015 knows what Ice 9 is,

And you're right about the creep thing. Men are brought up to believe that being sexual is important to their self-worth. It's an expectation that sexist culture places on men, the same way girls are supposed to be pretty.

Men are still supposed to be the initiators, so men are expected to approach women to attain this great benefit, but not be creepy. Unless you're good at it, it's a horrible position to be in. Feminism hasn't helped, but that's because men haven't freed themselves from sexist expectations the way women have. It's like men and women are living in different centuries. We need a men's movement that treats sexism, not feminism, as the problem. Feminism is not above criticism. but the current "Men's Right's" bullshit has no moral authority to address the problems with feminism.

Do I digress? To sum up, in my opinion, this creep shit that you're talking about is a form of sexism.

Who is this guy and why have all the ghosts been trashing him? He seems sweet to me!

Mr Holmes is a 60 year-old old man with a penchant for cats and underage girls (Boxxy in particular); he is our resident Grandpa, and various Orcs users have been feuding with him for... what? It's got to be years now, right?

I don't have a "penchant for underage girls", Homer, you dipshit.

I like Catie Wayne's videos a lot and I admire the way she stood up to being harrased and threatened by Btards, it really taught me a lot about the shit women have to face on the internet, and it's become an important issue in my 21st century politics, but I really can't think of another young female youtuber I'm a fan of. She';s cute, but it's her courage, talent and intelligence that inspire me as I try to make my own videos. She's smarter than either one of us. I've never said an unchaste word about Catie. And she's not underaged, she's 23.

"The ghosts" are trashing me? That doesn't sound good.

You don't have to say "unchaste things" to have a penchant for something, John. "Having a penchant for something" is a pretty innocuous term; indeed, I only used it because I wanted to be nice - what you've got with Boxxy goes WAY beyond penchant levels. You even tracked down her mom!

And you have most definitely said unchaste things about her. What about all those times you were talking about the rape stories you liked to read on 4chan?

>>You don't have to say "unchaste things" to have a penchant for something, John.

No, but if I haven't said anything, how do you know anything. Did you read my mind over the internet?

>> I only used it because I wanted to be nice.

ORLY? How sweet! I think you have a penchant for lying.

>>You even tracked down her mom!

Oh, fuck you. Her mom's on twitter. I clicked on the "follow" button.

>>what you've got with Boxxy goes WAY beyond penchant levels.

I make no bones about my fandom. I think Catie Wayne is the Mary Pickford of the internet. I don't know of anyone else who better understands and is better suited to the human side of the new technology.

fucking figures i am the one always hooking up with older guys! by ghosts i mean the 3-5 other people just with me who have been using this account, as well as Beam & Petey but that's as far as i see it having gone. so i am thinking about changing the password so only i can use it! who thinks i should?

I'd like that, but what would 1.0 want?

she would like a cold 4loko and a nice big fat shot of dope but she doesn't want anything now...:( BYE ZOE :( you got to roll with the punches on the road but it really is horrible how she went out...fun fact miles is looking at life with basically no possible avenue of escape. we are showing out for his prosecution to make sure he does not get away with it, i may even take the stand as i was the last to see them together

We should post a video in honor of her memory. Maybe you can think of something she'd like.

>> fun fact miles is looking at life with basically no possible avenue of escape

Fucking good. Whenever you guys get more info, please post it! I heard Miles was a fucking loser with a history of being abusive; I'd love to see that asshole get what's coming to him, and if you can help make that happen, then you're a goddamn hero in my books.

It is most definitely a position. It is the crux of your argument, and it is insane.

Do you d̲e̲n̲y̲ that you made the statement? Do you recant it?

Nothing says "Evil Homer" more than arguing about what your argument is. I'm not even sure that we disagree about Eliot Rodger.

Do you d̲e̲n̲y̲ that you made the statement? Do you recant it?

Of course not. And though might rewrite it for clarity, I do not recant it.

John how many hundreds of dollars of DSS money do you spend a week just talking to cam girls and asking them about their upbringing and surrounding circumstances and does that qualify as sex

(facepalm)

None and no.

Well then, rewrite it. Preferably in a manner which makes it mean something other than what it currently means, because otherwise we're back to square one.

Homer, we started on square zero, and that's where we're going to end.

whoa whoa whoa there Homer... it's possible to underline stuff in the text box?

I AM A WIZARD.

Also I used this http://fsymbols.com/generators/underline/

Roach, you should tell the other ghosts to sign up individually; lotsmoreorcs 2.0 through 6.0 or whatever. We could always do with lots more lotsmoreorcs.

Which is the one who really, REALLY hates JHMF? Whomever keeps Waugh'ing John is pretty funny.

KIts a little annoying, but it's way too extreme to take personally. Yeah, I guess it is kind of funny.