Corruption, cronism, and bureaucratic incompetence is only supposed to exist in private industry under objectivism/libertarianism.

Cronyism, too.

I for one look forward to working 16 hours a day for the North American Fresh Water Trust.

I'm sure they will be benevolent masters : D

Notice how they leave out the military, police, etc., the people that actually make government possible in the first place.

I wonder why they chose to eliminate them?

I can't wait until they all have to apply for welfare. And they will...

Because it's all they know.

The fascists were corporatists, no Godwin Law violation. Shut up.

Not sure you are using the term "corporatist" correctly. Sweden and Norway are corporatist countries; so were the fascist countries. The defining characteristic of corporatism is that government dictates the roles that business, agriculture, labor, religion, etc. are to play in society -- essentially, society is a body ("corpor") composed of organs that must act in concert. This can be done for the common good (Sweden / Norway) or in the service of a destructive ideology (fascist countries).

Subverting democracy through cronies and nepotism is a different thing. You could argue, perhaps, that cronyism is a backdoor way to achieve some limited form of corporatism, but it's a tremendously limited version.

Is there a law named for when people immediately bring up Godwin as fast and as often as possible in every internet discussion about politics? I'm actually asking..

baleen,

Godwin: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1."

Desc: "Vile Nazi children campaign against a bunch of stuff."

It's okay. We all overreact now and again.

I'm using corporatist correctly. I know what fascism means, thanks Bort.

Sweden and Norway are not corporatist. They both fiercely defend the right of individuals to start competitive businesses, and they fund them with little government oversight. Sweden has a highly successful voucher system in their educational system, for crying out loud, which is hardly corporatist. Sweden and Norway are market socialist nations, the former being a bit more market libertarian than the latter, both of which are pretty far away from corporatism.

In corporatist fascism, there is ONE union for every industry, sanctioned by the state. All industrial corporations must work in tandem, to be planned by a centralized consensus. This is why the rightwing industrialists (DuPont, Ford, etc.) prized fascism; it was a pretty good deal. It was a clean machine, free from the peskiness of uppity working classes and a free all you can eat meal into government troughs.

Let's go down the fascist/corporatist checklist, shall we?

- Do they feel that promoting the interests of successful businessmen is necessary and that the destruction of trade unions is also necessary?

- Do they feel that the power of the strong individual is to be more admired than the collective power of the "weak?"

- Do they, in general, feel that part of building a successful America would entail some kind of "spiritual awakening" to replace its wayward morality?

- Do they curiously reject the notion that military spending is somehow part of this big government cronyism, or at least stay mum on the subject, lest they drive away some of their most ardent ubermenschen? (Read a bit about Nazi economist Hjalmar Schact and his "falling out" with Hitler over reckless military spending)

So far, so good...

- Should markets favor those corporate entities that are the strongest, letting those that show "weakness" die? Should policy build upon the strengths of successful businesses by favoring them?

- "I absolutely insist on protecting private property... we must encourage private initiative." - Adolf Hitler

I don't know. It's not literally Nazi ideology, but they come mighty close to the bone.

Beard stroke imminent, BUT:

My grandmother lived through the rise of Fascism in Italy and what's happening on the right and center in America sounds an awful lot like the philosophy she described those guys as having.

baleen: you've described the backdoor by which cronyism can lead to something that somewhat resembles corporatism: get enough people in government who shill for a given range of interests, and they'll use the government to cater to that range of interests. That's still hardly corporatist, unless you're going to make the case that whatever range of interests is the only set of "organs" society needs.

You're unquestionably a very intelligent guy, but I still think you're dead wrong about Sweden and Norway. They can be described as market socialist, but they can be described just as well as corporatist, just not the fascist variety. Ford and DuPont may have had a boner for fascism, but the type of corporatism at work in Europe today would appall them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_corporatism#1930s-1970s:_N orway.2C_Sweden.2C_and_Austria